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Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2008 11:05 pm
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High Commander Vexen Sith Lord Second Degree Joined: 10 Mar 2006 Posts: 5107 Location: Building a Communist fighting robot Darth Cruiciatus wrote: So what's the issue with abortion again? Its legal...deal with it. If it wasn't, many more people would die. _________________

Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2008 6:53 am
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Darth Macht Sith Acolyte Joined: 28 Feb 2008 Posts: 239 Darth Cruiciatus wrote: So what's the issue with abortion again? The issue is that even from a secular standpoint this is considered by most people to be murder. Actually (I don't have a source that I can show, but trust me) there's a poll: Something like 69% of the people in the US believe abortion IS murder. Something like 20% of them believe it should be illegal. Because more people would die.... pfft. That's basically saying we'll ignore the deaths of innocent unborn children and look the other way so that people don't do illegal botched abortions and kill the baby and themselves. We're keeping it legal so people don't have to suffer the consequences of a stupid decision and can avoid it by killing their child. Back on topic, I honestly don't care about pre-marital sex from a secular standpoint. Even from a religious/morally-influenced-by-religion standpoint, I don't care what- for the most part- other people do with their lives. That's fine. But here's about underage sex which apparantally is included in this debate: There's only one problem I can see (which goes hand-in-hand with abortion) and that's raising a child. Most CHILDREN don't want to have CHILDREN (I know, this is sort of a "then they won't" idea and I agree.... but kids are idiots). Oh, and there's the solution: "underage" (it won't be called that if it become legalized" marriage. You'd have to lower the legal age of marriage without parental consent (18 is current. With parental consent I think it's.... what? 17?) to match that of the "underage" sex age. However, I DO think it's unwise for young children to jump into things like this too early in life, but it's their decision and if it doesn't harm anyone (perhaps them emotionally, but if nobody is harmed physically.... mentally.... etc.) I don't care what they do with their lives. _________________ Patron: Darth Nihilus

Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2008 8:59 am
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High Prophet Crozeus Sith Priest Joined: 24 Jul 2008 Posts: 4498 Location: I am yu, and he is mi. The age of consent is different in different countries. Here, it is 16 (raised from 12 in 1885). _________________

Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2008 1:38 pm
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Darth Cruiciatus Sith Master Joined: 25 Jan 2006 Posts: 1337 Location: With the sheep lovers- the Welsh High Commander Vexen wrote: Darth Cruiciatus wrote: So what's the issue with abortion again? Its legal...deal with it. If it wasn't, many more people would die. Have you been paying attention at all to my views on abortion? _________________

Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2008 7:45 pm
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Yodafueva Jedi Joined: 22 Jan 2006 Posts: 241 Location: Superunknown High Commander Vexen wrote: Darth Cruiciatus wrote: So what's the issue with abortion again? Its legal...deal with it. If it wasn't, many more people would die. Laughable. Here's your chance to assure me you were joking. _________________

Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2008 7:54 pm
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High Commander Vexen Sith Lord Second Degree Joined: 10 Mar 2006 Posts: 5107 Location: Building a Communist fighting robot I was...partially. It is true that women would still have abortions, legal or not...like beer during Prohibition. If they are legal...it makes it safe. _________________

Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2008 7:57 pm
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Yodafueva Jedi Joined: 22 Jan 2006 Posts: 241 Location: Superunknown High Commander Vexen wrote: I was...partially. It is true that women would still have abortions, legal or not...like beer during Prohibition. If they are legal...it makes it safe. If abortion were illegal it should be punishable by law. If the women has na abortion, she should be put in jail. It's good to hear you were joking, because that's like saying if murder in general were legal, more murders would happen. How many people do you think would murder others if murder was legal? A lot more. _________________

Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2008 8:14 pm
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Darth Macht Sith Acolyte Joined: 28 Feb 2008 Posts: 239 What you are saying, Vexen, is that you'll look the other way so some women can "safely" kill the unborn child. Because we wouldn't want to kill the child in an unsafe way would we? I feel both ways can be considered "unsafe" for the child, don't you? _________________ Patron: Darth Nihilus

Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2008 10:01 am
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High Mage Serratus Sith Marauder Joined: 25 Sep 2008 Posts: 1578 Location: Eating a bagel (LIKE A BOSS) Until its born its a parasite that has the potential to be a child. :\ After first sign of brain activity, its wrong to abort but until then, you can kill it just like you'd get dewormed. _________________ If you see dreadlocks and a staff coming towards you very rapidly, you're in trouble.

Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2008 12:10 pm
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Darth Macht Sith Acolyte Joined: 28 Feb 2008 Posts: 239 No, it's a child at a stage of life in which there is no brain activity. One of the main holes in your argument is that it is a human. One of the main holes in my argument is "pulling the plug" on a person in a coma :/ WHICH IS DIFFERENT THAN EUTHANASIA... sort of.... kind of.... not really.... _________________ Patron: Darth Nihilus

Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2008 2:05 pm
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Darth Cruiciatus Sith Master Joined: 25 Jan 2006 Posts: 1337 Location: With the sheep lovers- the Welsh Yodafueva wrote: High Commander Vexen wrote: I was...partially. It is true that women would still have abortions, legal or not...like beer during Prohibition. If they are legal...it makes it safe. If abortion were illegal it should be punishable by law. If the women has na abortion, she should be put in jail. So why do people smoke marijuana still? Making something illegal doesn't always work. In the case of murder, yes, but thats because murder has always been illegal. _________________

Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2008 2:27 pm
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High Prophet Crozeus Sith Priest Joined: 24 Jul 2008 Posts: 4498 Location: I am yu, and he is mi. I think putting her in jail may be taking it a bit too far. There isn't enough space as it is, innocent women who have had abortions shouldn't be put there with some psycho killers (ques que se). _________________

Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2008 2:30 pm
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Darth Macht Sith Acolyte Joined: 28 Feb 2008 Posts: 239 "Innocent"....? Abortion should be legally equivalent to murder and punishable in the same way. _________________ Patron: Darth Nihilus

Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2008 2:34 pm
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High Prophet Crozeus Sith Priest Joined: 24 Jul 2008 Posts: 4498 Location: I am yu, and he is mi. Yeah, cause that'll work. Kill them too. In England and Wales, 2007, there were 195,850 abortions. Since there are 70 million people there, and 300 million in the US, that's about 750,000 women you would need to execute for having an abortion. Each year. _________________

Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2008 2:48 pm
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Darth Macht Sith Acolyte Joined: 28 Feb 2008 Posts: 239 Or life in prison. Don't dumb down sentences because everyone is a criminal. That makes no sense. Statistics shouldn't dictate law. _________________ Patron: Darth Nihilus

Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2008 2:52 pm
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High Prophet Crozeus Sith Priest Joined: 24 Jul 2008 Posts: 4498 Location: I am yu, and he is mi. No, I think you are taking it too far. If you want to ban abortion, fine, that means illegal abortions won't recieve state funding and could pose a threat to the mother, therefore they won't want to do it. But abortion holds its own thread. _________________

Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2008 8:39 pm
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Darth Cruiciatus Sith Master Joined: 25 Jan 2006 Posts: 1337 Location: With the sheep lovers- the Welsh Darth Macht wrote: Or life in prison. Don't dumb down sentences because everyone is a criminal. That makes no sense. Statistics shouldn't dictate law. So we should pay taxes to feed them, give them health checkups, etc. over abortion?!? That is an incredibly extreme view. _________________

Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2008 8:36 am
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Darth Macht Sith Acolyte Joined: 28 Feb 2008 Posts: 239 We pay taxes to give them abortions, Sam. _________________ Patron: Darth Nihilus

Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2008 8:41 am
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High Prophet Crozeus Sith Priest Joined: 24 Jul 2008 Posts: 4498 Location: I am yu, and he is mi. Well, we don't pay taxes anyway. _________________

Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2008 9:03 am
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Darth Macht Sith Acolyte Joined: 28 Feb 2008 Posts: 239 What? _________________ Patron: Darth Nihilus

Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2008 9:09 am
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High Prophet Crozeus Sith Priest Joined: 24 Jul 2008 Posts: 4498 Location: I am yu, and he is mi. I don't, and neither does he. You might, I don't know. I doubt very many on this site do. _________________

Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2008 9:11 am
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Darth Macht Sith Acolyte Joined: 28 Feb 2008 Posts: 239 I admit, I don't pay taxes. Well, that could sound illegal.... I admit, I'm not an adult (surprise, surprise!) I was stating that we as a population pay taxes to support abortion in public hospitals/abortion centers, do we not? _________________ Patron: Darth Nihilus

Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2008 9:13 am
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High Prophet Crozeus Sith Priest Joined: 24 Jul 2008 Posts: 4498 Location: I am yu, and he is mi. The adult majority pay taxes to fund the hospitals and the healthcare they provide. There is no addition to tax called "abortion tax". _________________

Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2008 9:15 am
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Darth Macht Sith Acolyte Joined: 28 Feb 2008 Posts: 239 One of the "healthcare" services is abortion. Therefore, you are, in fact, funding abortion. _________________ Patron: Darth Nihilus

Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2008 9:16 am
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High Prophet Crozeus Sith Priest Joined: 24 Jul 2008 Posts: 4498 Location: I am yu, and he is mi. If you were to not fund the healthcare, you wouldn't be funding abortion yes, but neither would you be funding the other vital services they provide. _________________

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